[00:00:00] Speaker A: Sa.
[00:00:31] Speaker B: If you dig the twisted, admire the outlandish, and are enamored by the unusual, you're in the right place.
True crime, the supernatural, the unexplained. Now you're speaking our language. If you agree, join us as we dive into the darker side. You know, because it's more fun over here.
Welcome to Total Conundrum.
[00:00:57] Speaker A: Warning.
[00:00:58] Speaker B: Some listeners may find the following content disturbing. Listener discretion is advised.
[00:01:09] Speaker C: All right, you guys, we have a really special treat for you guys today. We have a group of people that actually went and stayed at the Roth house and did their own investigation and kind of chatted with a few of them here and there, and we got a group of them together, and we're going to talk about the Roth house, the Watseka Wonder, and what they experienced when they stayed there. And then we'll kind of touch base a little bit on what we experienced.
So let's go one by one in order. Do you guys want to introduce yourselves, tell us what you know, what group you're a part of, and go from there?
[00:01:47] Speaker B: Sure.
[00:01:48] Speaker D: I'll jump in. I'm Christina, and I am a member of the Wisconsin Apparition Tracking Society, AKA twats.
[00:01:57] Speaker C: I love that.
[00:01:59] Speaker D: Thank you.
And I went with our team here, kind of knowing what was, you know, the history behind the house. I usually prefer to remain clueless, but this one was a tough one to do that.
[00:02:16] Speaker E: Yeah.
[00:02:17] Speaker D: And it was an adventure, so we had a great time.
[00:02:23] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:02:24] Speaker E: And I'm Denise. Oh, I'm sorry, Christina, are you done?
[00:02:27] Speaker D: I'm done. Go ahead.
[00:02:28] Speaker E: Okay. I'm Denise. I'm also part of the Wisconsin Apparition Tracking Society, the twats.
As Christina said, we went back in April, we went to the Roth house, and we spent two nights there. And it was kind of a crossover event then, too, because we had Catherine from I scream, you scream. And then we had another group of fine young ladies from the Quite unusual podcast that stayed with us as well. We came across.
We have so many stories. We learned a lot about the house and the different people that actually lived there, and it kind of extends beyond what a lot of people know or what we came across. So very excited to share stories.
[00:03:13] Speaker F: So I'm Frankie, and I am the newest member of twats first and foremost. And also as a team, we also co produced the Windy City Parafest. So that's where you can find most of me. Yeah, we stayed two nights at the Roth house so that we could party and investigate.
[00:03:32] Speaker A: All right, I'm Kim. I'm the last member of the Wisconsin Apparition Tracking Society and also one of the co producers of the Windy City Paranormal Festival. And yeah, I am usually kind of a little bit of a tech nerd, but I don't really know how to use all of it and am very unsuccessful with a lot of it sometimes, so it's kind of amusing. But yeah, that's, that's me.
[00:03:58] Speaker G: Hi, my name is Katherine. I am not part of the twats.
I am one half of Ice Cream you Scream podcast. My co host Gina lives in the UK so she was not at the Roff House, but she was there in spirit. We met the twats when we had Christina and Frankie on our podcast a few months ago to talk about the Windy City Para Fest and we just clicked right away and it was my first ever investigation and so overwhelming in the best way. I, I've been telling everyone since then that it honestly may have ruined investigating for me because it was just fantastic. It was such a great experience. So, um, yeah, like I said, I'm from Ice Cream you Scream podcast. You can find
[email protected] we're on all the socials and yeah, well, hopefully more investigations with the twats as well. I'm going to be infiltrating as much as I can.
I just like to invite myself places. That's how, that's how I live my life.
[00:05:02] Speaker C: Yeah, I love it.
[00:05:04] Speaker D: You're definitely a twat by association.
[00:05:05] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, yeah, 100%.
[00:05:08] Speaker C: And where can we find the twats?
[00:05:11] Speaker D: We are on Instagram and Facebook. You will find us under the Wisconsin as in WI Apparition Tracking Society. We also have a TikTok and as Frankie mentioned, we have all of the socials for Windy City Paranormal Festival as well. So you can find us in both places.
[00:05:34] Speaker C: Wonderful.
Frankie, why don't you give us a little rundown on Windy City? I was listening to that on Dairyland Frights podcast. It was right before your festival.
So do you want to give us a little rundown on it?
[00:05:48] Speaker F: Yeah, it was kind of amazing and I can't believe that it was over a month ago that we, that we had like. It feels like it was yesterday and 10 years ago. We had such a great time. The entire mission was to amplify underrepresented voices in the, in the paranormal space. And I think, I don't know, just from the feedback from guests and present centers, I think we nailed it. Like folks had a great time. It was feel like we have a bigger family now than we had going in it.
[00:06:17] Speaker D: Just.
[00:06:17] Speaker F: I can't wait to do it again.
[00:06:18] Speaker C: Yeah, hopefully we can make it. We're not. We're in Minnesota, so we're not sure. And I have a sister that lives in McHenry, Illinois, so only about.
[00:06:27] Speaker F: I'm hoping by next year, you know, folks are feeling better about traveling and spending money and that kind of thing. You know, I think that was. Was a thing that we were up against this year, but now that we've done one and, you know, everyone had such a great time, I think the word's gonna kind of spread. So we'd love to have you.
[00:06:43] Speaker C: Yeah, definitely. And when you guys plan the next one, send us the information and we'll make sure to share it for you as well.
[00:06:49] Speaker D: Thank you. Absolutely.
[00:06:51] Speaker C: Thank you.
Of course.
So, like I mentioned before and in some of our other podcasts, Jeremy and I actually went to the Roth house and we stayed two nights as well.
And we met the owner, John had a long discussion with him.
He played us some audio clips of things that people have sent him that stayed there.
I love everything spooky, but I am scared to death of it in the same. So I was the one that was staring at the ceiling every night, like, why is everybody sleeping? How can everybody be sleeping?
And we slept in that kind of in between room, in between the sitting room and that back room. We made sure to.
[00:07:36] Speaker B: One of the devil pictures were.
[00:07:38] Speaker G: Yeah, that's where I was. That was my room.
[00:07:41] Speaker A: All by herself?
[00:07:43] Speaker C: Yeah, right by the stairs. So we took one of the double pictures down and put it across the stairs so nobody would fall down the stairs.
And the other one, I think we just flipped over. When I went up, walked upstairs, at first I was like, are you kidding me?
But John said that a friend of his is an artist, and he actually painted those for him. So there wasn't any, like, demonic thing meaning behind it. It was just something that his friend had painted and he really enjoyed.
And I know, like, John is very iffy if, you know, I know he had that. Did you guys know about the psychic experience that he had when he was renovating the house?
[00:08:26] Speaker A: No.
[00:08:26] Speaker D: No.
[00:08:28] Speaker C: So when he was renovating the house, he was just down because it was taking so much money, so much time, so much energy.
And basically he sat in the middle of one room and just shouted. He's like, I can't take this anymore.
And one of his friends, who is a psychic, called him the next day and told him that a woman came to him or came to her and said, it'll all be worth it.
You just have to just push through.
And she had no idea that he was feeling like that, that he had said anything.
And they basically said that they appreciated what he was doing. I can't remember if he actually said who the woman was or not, but that kind of helped him feel like he was doing the right thing.
[00:09:20] Speaker D: I'll jump in and say that from our experience there, I have no doubt that it was Catherine Clifton, probably one of the more recent owners of the home. And it seems that she owned the home for quite some time. But she was kind of the person that we didn't expect and we knew nothing about and who showed up in a big, strong way for us while we were investigating.
[00:09:48] Speaker C: Yeah, that's interesting. I haven't looked into any of the current history of the house. I kind of focused on the Roth side, so I'm excited to hear a little bit about that too.
[00:09:58] Speaker D: Yeah.
[00:09:59] Speaker C: The other thing that he shared is that he has a copy of the letter from Nervi or Minerva, Mary Roth's sister, basically with her statement of everything that happened was true.
And he trying to think what else he said. Do you remember, Jeremy, if there was anything that I missed?
Okay, well. And before we went there, we have a couple friends who are into the paranormal and they both have abilities.
And I had asked Megan to remote view into the property and just let us know what we were looking into or what we were getting ourselves into.
And she had said that there was kind of a Ying and yang spirit or two ying and yang spirits in the house. There was like an old hag type person up in that sitting room upstairs.
And then there was more of a dark energy in the basement. And they both had the same eyes, almost like swirling eyes.
And then after she closed her remote view session later that night, this woman came to her, said that she had followed back the. The trail or the tail or whatever of the remote view, the string.
And the woman was flipping between a doll and a human.
And she said that the woman had said that her spirit was trapped in the doll, basically, and she had been in the house for a long time.
Well, I'd mentioned that to John, and he kind of like sat up a little straighter. And he's like, really?
And he goes, follow me. Brings us up to. I think it was. Would have been the master bedroom upstairs.
And he walked into the closet and pulled out three dolls. And the dolls were not original to any of the owners in that have owned the house.
There was this.
This gentleman that was known to be kind of, we'll just say, a little on the obscure side from town.
And he would show up at all of the events that they would have there, and he would just randomly just sit there and stare at the property. Well, when that man, before he passed away, he asked John to take the dolls in because he thought they would be a good fit for the home.
John didn't really like him. He put him in the closet, that attic closet.
And when the guy passed away mysteriously, like a week later, the man's guitar showed up leaning up against a tree outside.
And he doesn't know how the guitar got there or anything, but John thought it was very interesting that I had said something about her seeing these. This doll and these dolls were in the house. So that was kind of our conversation with John.
We, Jeremy, didn't feel anything. Actually. We all left the one day to go venture out into town and kind of talk to some of the townspeople. Jeremy actually took a nap.
When he was there during the day, he was down in the basement for a while.
I went down there. He finally convinced me to go down to the basement.
And while we were down there, we were getting some REM POD activity.
We came upstairs and I was playing the video of the REM POD activity we were having in the basement.
And we set the REM pod on top of the grand piano in that. That main living room.
And all of a sudden the REM pod started reacting at the same time as what it was in the video.
So the video I'm playing saying, can you touch this? And then the REM pod would go off in the video end on the grand piano, like, okay, can you back away?
And it would stop in the video and on the grand piano.
And we had ring camera set up. And on the ring camera, I caught footage of. When I asked it what its name was, all you hear is a.
Just like this kind of growly. You can't make it out. Can't say it was actually legit. But there was no other interference on any other video from the ring cameras.
And I'm trying to think the.
I think that was pretty much the only thing that we really experienced there. Do you remember? Oh, no.
[00:14:40] Speaker B: Weird orb thing.
[00:14:41] Speaker C: Yes. Jeremy was videoing me up in that sitting room upstairs.
We were on an Instagram live.
And this orb. Why don't you describe it, Jeremy?
[00:14:53] Speaker B: Well, basically, I'm recording her, and as I'm watching her, like a ball of light kind of came out from the top of her head, went up towards the corner of the ceiling and then over in the other direction towards me. And it was just kind of moving in weird directions and stuff, so. But it was the only one that we ever caught that night.
[00:15:17] Speaker C: I'll send this stuff to you guys too, so you can hear it and see it. Yeah, very cool.
The only other thing that I remember being of significance is that Jill, she was sitting. It was either Jill or Pam, one of the girls we were with. She was sitting on the couch in that main living room by herself. And she's scrolling on her phone and you can see it. You know, it's just her on the ring camera. You can hear some laughing and, you know, joking around from the kitchen. So you can hear that in the background.
And all of a sudden you hear three knocks, like right by her. She stops and she looks around and she goes, who's in the bathroom? Because she said it sounded like it came from the bathroom under the stairs.
And she sat there for a minute and then she walks over to the bathroom. She opens the door and she's like, okay. Then it walks into the other room and she's like, is anybody knocking? But you could clearly hear it in that room.
And so those were the big experiences that we had when we were there. But like I said, there was so much noise and like, half the people were partying, the other half were trying to do things. And we had some activity on like the GEO box. I don't even know if we've actually even gone through all of our recordings yet. There was just so much because we had so many different things set up and just finding the time to go through it. That's the hard thing about paranormal investigating.
[00:16:45] Speaker A: I actually. I actually just started going through some of our recordings the last couple of days. And I never do this, but at Roff House I just left my recorder running. And so I. I have at least between two recordings or three recordings, I have probably a full 24 hours.
[00:17:05] Speaker C: Wow.
[00:17:05] Speaker A: Of recording to go through. And I think I've gone through three hours so far.
[00:17:11] Speaker C: That's hard.
[00:17:12] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. But I think the thing that's. That's interesting that I want to point out is Noel had brought her big mouth Billy Bass and he was on the piano and nobody would be in the piano room. And it's motion, it's motion activated and it would just start going off. And we all went to bed at what, like three, three or four the first night, maybe even five.
And Denise and I slept in the first bedroom on the stairs in the front of the house. And the piano is right below us. Yes. So I was trying to sleep and all I could hear was big mouth Billy Bass going on like going off like every 20 minutes.
[00:17:54] Speaker C: Oh, no, same song.
[00:17:57] Speaker D: I woke up to it around like 10 in the morning and I was like, oh, maybe someone's downstairs making coffee.
[00:18:04] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:18:04] Speaker F: Singing Don't Worry, Be Happy.
[00:18:06] Speaker D: Yeah, maybe someone's making us coffee. Yeah, yeah. And it just kept happening. And finally I went downstairs and then Catherine joined me and we realized that no, it was just going off all night. And it was funny because as soon as we were downstairs and sitting there in the dining room enjoying some coffee and chit chatting, it stopped. As soon as we came downstairs, it stopped. And then I think Frankie came downstairs next and it popped up and went off when he walked by.
And so the battery hadn't died, it was still working normal and just behaved itself. But overnight it was. And it was sitting right on the grand piano where you said you had your REM pod. So that room was that, that front living room was pretty active for us. We also did some, our version of Estes method in, in that room as well. And you know, I think that room though did seem, I think it would, it only makes sense it would be the room where guests would be entertained as well. But I can say going into it for us, I knew the history. I knew about the Watseka wonder. I for those who are listening, it's the first recorded case of possession in the United States. And I knew that it was a spiritualist family, or at least some of them were. So being a practicing witch, I had prepared some spell work for us to do while we were there. I also went in with the thought of trying to approach it from as much as I knew of a spiritualist sense. So we did make sure that we spent a lot of time in that dining room and in the round at the table.
But I will agree, when I walked in at first it wasn't the feeling of there's something being in the house. Frankie and I walked in through the dining room into the kitchen as you come in that front door off to the left hand side.
And it was the two of us looked at each other and we both kind of agreed that we didn't feel a lot in the house at the moment, but what we felt was someone looking at us. And it was bright, broad daylight, but we felt like someone was watching us from outside.
There was a lot of observation happening and he and I kept remarking that that is really the overall feeling that we felt was that there was this observation, and I think, you know, I tried to really set my intention ahead of time, that we were respectful of that spiritualist sense that we wanted to come into the space and respect that. I established the spell work that we did as a group at that dining room table. Very gentle, loving. It just helped open up the communication. Nothing scary. I actually was so comfortable in the house. I stayed back while everyone ran errands and I took a nap at one point.
[00:21:02] Speaker C: That was Jeremy.
[00:21:03] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:21:04] Speaker D: Yeah. And. And just really felt a comfort. So we had some very diverse experiences as far as physical things happening while we were doing spellwork. And I think another time we were just sitting at the dining room table chatting. We had multiple occasions where the door in the kitchen to the garage, which, if you're sitting at the head of the table that faces the front of the house with your back to the kitchen, it's directly, you know, a few steps behind you out into the attached little garage that's there.
[00:21:38] Speaker F: And it.
[00:21:38] Speaker D: It popped open at one point. That really startled us.
[00:21:42] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:21:42] Speaker D: But it did pop open on more than one occasion for us to the point where we finally put some things in front of it. And we played around with that door. That door, you know, didn't have a tendency, when you walked in a certain spot to open. It did not have a tendency, you know, to have a handle that didn't latch all the way.
It just was one of those experiences where we.
[00:22:02] Speaker C: Was that the door by the washer and dryer?
[00:22:05] Speaker D: No, it was actually the door that would be just to the left of the stove.
[00:22:11] Speaker E: Yeah.
[00:22:12] Speaker C: Okay.
[00:22:12] Speaker D: There's a hutch on the. On the wall to your left as well, but it's kind of between there. That was.
[00:22:17] Speaker C: Yeah, we had the washer and dryer. That little screen door in there kept popping open on us. We assumed it was wind or something. It was during the day, never at night. But the big door in the dining room did blow open as well when we were. When only a couple people were there. Not everybody was there yet.
And again, they're like, well, I'm hoping it was the wind.
[00:22:42] Speaker D: So I will say that big door at the front of the house in the dining room does not latch.
[00:22:46] Speaker A: Correct.
[00:22:47] Speaker D: At least when we were there.
So that, you know, we always.
I always say, though, you know, we have all this equipment. For me, the experience is what I can say that really happened. I witnessed it. Right. I can go back and listen to audio. I can look at video. And it's wonderful to have.
I appreciate it.
But how do you know, it's not someone else talking in another room, especially when you get a big group like this. Right, right.
But we. We did. I think we've gathered some good evidence from that experience. I believe Denise was able to capture the back door opening on us at one point, and Catherine.
Catherine caught. Yeah. An image that just absolutely blows my mind. Do you want to share?
[00:23:37] Speaker G: I'm very proud of that one.
Well, it's funny, because we. The reason I remembered to even send it to you all, I. Because I also took forever to go through my photos, but I was talking. Gina and I were talking on a recent recording of our podcast that I am notorious for spotting faces in a window. That's, like, my favorite thing to look for. I am face in a window girl for some reason. And I caught one.
I got a face in the window.
It was during that time we were all setting up. We, you know, we're kind of getting ready to get. Ready to get started for the evening.
And it was that time that Christina was talking about that everyone was kind of feeling like we were being watched. Not. Not in a bad way. Just in, like, it kind of felt like they were.
They're used to people being there. They're used to seeing a whole bunch of different people. They were kind of clocking us and just seeing what our vibe was.
And Christina and Frankie had been talking about that. And I was just going through. Taking photos on my camera, just casually, honestly, mostly just because the house is beautiful and I wanted photos. Like, I wasn't looking for anything. I wasn't trying to get anything.
But then when I was going through them, there was one shot where I was standing in the living room that, like, entry. That front room, the piano was on my left, and I was pointing the camera toward the stairwell and the front door.
And in the window next to the door, you can see what I think looks like a face. And if you look closely, there are actually a couple of spots in that window that you can see. Multiple spots that look like they could be faces. There's a couple that I'm like, whoa. I immediately was like, I. I can't not see this one once I. Once I look at it, but I can send it to you guys. But, yeah, that was. That was the. The one that I got that I was like, okay, I'm.
I'm putting this in my personal inventory, because, yeah, that was on the other one. There wasn't anything that could reflect on it or anything. So, yeah, I was proud of that one.
[00:25:45] Speaker A: Nothing there. It's the Closest thing is a tree, which is in the yard.
[00:25:50] Speaker G: Yeah.
[00:25:51] Speaker D: And I think the thing that was most remarkable to me was the most obvious face. If you take and look at a photo of Mary Roth and you look at this face, you're seeing, you know, kind of this outline here, the hairline and this hairstyle is almost exactly the same. The nose shape, the jawline.
It looks like the image of Mary Roth that's in the house, but there's no way that that would be reflecting because it's actually on the same wall, and there's not a reflective surface across the way.
So it did seem interesting that that was the capture right around the time that we're all having that experience.
[00:26:30] Speaker G: Yeah.
[00:26:31] Speaker C: And it's so interesting that a lot of it happens in that one room where the seance is. If I remember correctly, the seances that they had were in the dining room.
[00:26:40] Speaker E: Dining room.
[00:26:41] Speaker C: And from what John was saying, I believe the table in the basement was original to the home when he bought it. Okay, so there's that table in the far. I don't know if it was still there, but in the far back room in the basement.
[00:26:58] Speaker A: I don't think we even got to the basement.
[00:27:01] Speaker G: Did any of us go to the basement? I forgot there even was one.
[00:27:04] Speaker D: I am not a spider girl. Frankie, I remember dared me. Me to go in the basement, and I was like, first of all, I'm over six feet tall, so, yep, those ceilings look really low to me. And also, I don't want spiders in my hair. So you know what? I'll hang out with ghosts all day long, but I am not hanging out with spiders in my hair. So.
[00:27:27] Speaker C: Had a very. Jeremy didn't say he's never had a paranormal experience, so he's very skeptical. So he didn't feel anything. I just felt very. It was heavy when I was in the basement, and it took a lot for them to convince me. It was like day two.
And I went down there, and then he, of course, wanted all the lights off. And I'm like.
But at the bottom of the stairs, there's actually, like a hole in the wall that goes under.
Like you. It's dug out, so I don't even know what is back there or what, you know. For the most part, the basement was pretty clean, and I didn't. It didn't feel like it was too cobwebby when we were there, but it was just. It was.
[00:28:13] Speaker F: Well, we're going back in September, so.
[00:28:15] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:28:16] Speaker C: Are you?
[00:28:16] Speaker D: Yeah.
[00:28:17] Speaker F: Yeah, yeah.
[00:28:17] Speaker C: How fun.
[00:28:18] Speaker F: Basement time it is.
[00:28:20] Speaker D: All Right. All right.
[00:28:23] Speaker E: You can wear a helmet.
[00:28:24] Speaker D: Yeah.
[00:28:25] Speaker C: Or a bathing cap.
[00:28:26] Speaker D: I'm going to wear like a beekeeper.
[00:28:28] Speaker C: There you go.
[00:28:29] Speaker A: There we go.
[00:28:33] Speaker C: So you were saying that you had come across some new history on the.
[00:28:39] Speaker D: Yes. So one of the things that happened, and I can't remember when she kind of became forth for us, if it was when it might have been when Frankie was under for Estes at the.
[00:28:51] Speaker G: Dining room table, I think wasn't it during I started suspecting she was there during.
When we were doing the board.
[00:29:00] Speaker D: Oh, yes, we were.
[00:29:02] Speaker G: Remember, she was.
Yeah. She was telling other people to keep them their thoughts to themselves.
[00:29:10] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:29:10] Speaker D: She wanted to speak.
Very direct woman. She has a very distinct, stylish look. And I know Frankie saw her and at first she know. And I can see this, she almost came across as masculine. But if as we got to know more about her, that. That makes sense for her time was Katherine Clifton. And so we now refer to the house as the Roth Clifton house because of her presence.
But we did do a dive into the history of her. The. The quiets, Nick and Noel, who were unable to join us today. They also had looked into the history of her for us overnight after that first night. And we found out so much about her. So she owned the home. Her. Her stepfather had actually left her the home. She owned the home. She was a pilot and she managed a large area of the farms around.
[00:30:05] Speaker F: Yeah, like thousands of acres.
[00:30:06] Speaker D: Thousands of acres. She would fly her plane to check on the status of those. In her passing, she actually left a large amount of money to the city to have the current courthouse at City hall built for that area.
But she wasn't necessarily the most loved person in the city because she was a very strong, outspoken woman, a woman ahead of her time who did. Yeah, she really was. She was super artistic. She loved the property. She's actually the person who built the pool and the grotto in the back. All of those stones were from her travels around the world.
She did a lot to the home to take care of it and she was very present for us and it. It wasn't in. She was persistent and she was very forward, but it was more in the matter of like, hey, I'm a big part of the history of this home as well. Without her, I don't think that home would have been even in the condition that it was when the current owners got it. And I know they did an immense amount of work on the home as well.
But she really. It was. There are many photos of her now in the Home.
And at first, like, I tried not to look at those photos. They're all kind of on an easel in the back living room there on the main floor because I didn't want it to influence anything. But they are our photos of her life and her time there. Her plane parked outside of the house.
[00:31:40] Speaker A: Yep.
[00:31:40] Speaker F: That's my favorite one.
[00:31:41] Speaker D: Yeah. Yeah, I love that one.
[00:31:44] Speaker C: And so where was the pool? In the back?
[00:31:46] Speaker D: It's actually. If you walk out the raised patio.
[00:31:50] Speaker C: Okay.
[00:31:51] Speaker D: The grotto is to your left, up against the house.
[00:31:54] Speaker C: I remember that.
[00:31:55] Speaker D: Continue walking straight ahead. There's some trees in the back yard line. There is an area where there's another patio there out towards the back.
[00:32:05] Speaker C: Yes.
[00:32:05] Speaker D: That is actually the pool.
[00:32:07] Speaker C: Okay.
We have some drone footage. I'll have to look and see if you can actually still see.
[00:32:15] Speaker D: Cool.
[00:32:16] Speaker C: Yeah. The ground will settle, so I'll have to see if it's.
[00:32:18] Speaker D: Yeah, it's actually filled in. So it is like a patio out back there. There's.
[00:32:23] Speaker A: Oh, there is, I believe one of the. One of the pictures that's on the easel actually shows it. And you can actually see that it was a pool.
[00:32:34] Speaker C: See, I don't think that easel was there when we were there.
Interesting. I.
Yeah, I don't remember it. And is that in the room with the old fashioned record player?
[00:32:46] Speaker G: Yes.
[00:32:47] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:32:47] Speaker C: Okay.
[00:32:47] Speaker D: Yeah, I don't remember you.
[00:32:49] Speaker G: Definitely. Yeah, if it was there, you would have seen it.
[00:32:51] Speaker E: You would have noticed it.
[00:32:52] Speaker G: It's pretty prominent. Yeah, yeah.
[00:32:55] Speaker F: It's in the room with the great painting of Jesus.
[00:33:00] Speaker D: Yeah. The last day that we were there, I finally allowed myself then to look through all of them. And Denise went outside and tried to recreate some of the photos together.
[00:33:10] Speaker C: Oh, fun.
[00:33:11] Speaker D: Yeah.
[00:33:12] Speaker C: Yeah, very fun. Yes. That piece of history was missing when we were there.
[00:33:16] Speaker E: Send you some of that too.
[00:33:18] Speaker D: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[00:33:20] Speaker E: I think I have photos of the photos. And then.
[00:33:22] Speaker C: Yeah, that would be awesome.
[00:33:24] Speaker E: What we tried to do.
[00:33:26] Speaker C: Yeah, there's the way they decorated that house was just.
It's beautiful.
[00:33:31] Speaker D: Yeah.
[00:33:32] Speaker C: I did a full walk through with, you know, videotaping every, you know, the. All the rooms. And I almost fell down the stairs because it was my first time walking down the stairs. And those airborne aren't all secure. They were when we were there.
[00:33:47] Speaker D: It's kind of steep.
[00:33:49] Speaker C: Yes. And I know I'd seen there is a filmmaker and ghost hunter, his name is Cam Crosby, I believe, and I think he's part of Dark Lux production. I watched a YouTube video of his investigation before we went There. And when he was there, the house was not finished.
And he had a psychic that was there, and he was supposed to come and meet us there that weekend because he wanted to see the inside, how, you know, the house now that it was finished. And he was going to share some of the information with us, but he had a family emergency and wasn't able to make it, so.
So that was kind of a bummer. But we did, like, said we got to meet John, and that was amazing. Had him over, come over for dinner and sit with us and. Yeah, nice.
[00:34:41] Speaker F: Yeah.
[00:34:42] Speaker C: Yeah.
So what else did you guys experience or encounter?
[00:34:47] Speaker A: I was gonna say one of my favorite things was going to the cemetery because we knew that. And we found Catherine's family mausoleum and where she's buried. And just a lot of people in the Roth family buried in the cemetery there. And so it was really like the spiritualist community. There's a lot of markers in there, which Christina knows a lot about that stuff. So that was really. That was really a fun history lesson that, you know, we didn't really know. So it was really good to tie that in to the investigation that we were having. So.
[00:35:22] Speaker F: Yeah. And the cemetery, it was interesting that, like, in the middle of the 19th century, up into the early 20th century, you don't see any, like, crosses or, you know, in hock signo kind of stuff that you. You would see in a Christian, you know, in a similar town in America of that time tended to be Christian. There's none of that until, like, about 1915, 1920. So it's obviously a very spiritualist community because they. They didn't use those types of symbols typically.
But it. That. That cemetery has a really great feel.
The energy is really, like, fantastic.
That was a highlight, for sure.
[00:36:01] Speaker D: Yeah, We. I had looked up the information for Mary Roth because. And just all. All of the family to see if anyone had been buried nearby.
And she. She was the one who was closest and the one who was most prominent in the story.
Unfortunately, you know, other people who were prominent to the story, besides her family, are not nearby in the cemetery. So we went. I had no clue about the cemetery layout or where she was.
And my favorite part was that we're riding in the car and, you know, it's kind of a winding cemetery. And we come around a corner, and Kimberly was driving, and I was like, stop the car right now.
And she did. And if you look exactly to my right, like, up the hill, all of a sudden, right there, I got out, just walked. Right. I don't know How? Don't know why. Just it was one of those things where she was like, I'm right here. And we. I had brought in a gift and offering for her to leave. And we also left something at Catherine's grave, which not knowing about Catherine before we went, I didn't know that she was also there. But before we left we did check and she was buried there. So that was just one of those things where it was very meaningful to have had the first night of interaction and then be able to go to the cemetery. And also went past the courthouse where Noel had gotten out and walked to the front of the building and actually heard her name spoken while she was standing there to the point where it made her feel unsettled. And it's not as if there were other people around. Yeah, yeah.
[00:37:41] Speaker C: Very small town.
[00:37:42] Speaker D: It is, yes, yes. And that's kind of out of the town a little bit. And we also went past the other home involved in the story, which used to be a home that you could utilize for investigation and unfortunately no longer.
[00:37:57] Speaker C: So is that the original Roth home or the Venom home?
[00:38:01] Speaker D: The Lorenzo Venom home? Yeah, yeah, yeah. And just took a moment to drive by and acknowledge everyone. The opportunity to do that when it presents itself is something that, you know, we find important as a team. Just our approach being super gentle and our focus being interaction over capturing evidence that that's kind of when where we set ourselves apart and what we have had great success with for us, we, some of us have previously been on a team that's very fact based and as techie and scientific as it can be. So as Kim said, we have all of that, we use it, but our focus is really that feeling of connection and interaction.
One of the things I had also done was thought about the sense that in a spiritualist community, oftentimes they would still get up and go to church every Sunday morning, even though they had a say on Saturday night.
But as Frankie said, they're not going to present themselves in the traditional sense of Christianity. So there is an absence of a lot of that in the cemetery, which just kind of feeds into that concept.
We had some Estes sessions that helped to support that. But I had felt really called before. We went to do something that we had never done before as a regular thing. I had tried it once at a previous investigation, just briefly, and that was to bring some tuning forks and work with frequency while we were trying to communicate. I just felt really called to that in the spiritualist community and had this sense that there was something to do with Frequency or sound. That was their method. That particular group of people's method for finding that space or that zone that you get into when you're reading.
As a seer, I'm familiar with that, and it happens differently for everyone, but when you're collectively working on it, usually you have a collective trigger. I didn't really conceptualize it fully. I just knew that I felt drawn to bring frequency and sound into the investigation and hadn't really shared it with the team that I recall, other than that I had said to you guys on the previous investigation we had done elsewhere that, like, hey, I have these in my bag. And Frankie went under for an estus method session during the spell work that we did and had an incredible experience that played into that. So I'll let him explain that from his point of view.
[00:40:42] Speaker F: It's interesting because it's, you know, this was months ago ago now, and I. I want.
I want to remember. I wanted to, like, go, well, I can barely remember it because it was months ago. You know how investigation get, like, you know, these experiences, but then over time, you start to go. I don't remember if it was. If it was the first night or second night. No, I re. This is, like, super clear to me.
And the. The sounds that I was hearing, I still hear every day. I still can't explain them. I've tried. I've tried to write about them. But what happens during this early part of our investigation was I went under SDEs and I was using the mind blockers, which is like the frequency that, you know, so you can't hear anything, and that the glasses with the. With the Reddit lights is. You kind of like, it's not really a trance necessarily, but it just kind of gets you in this receptive place.
And we were doing some candle magic as well, but I couldn't see any of it because I'm, you know, totally, like, sensory depth.
But I started to see in my mind, mind's eye, a storm coming and coming from the east. And, like, as I was starting to talk about that, you can see. I don't know if we get this on video. I feel like we did, but at that point, I started talking about, you know, a storm and a wind coming in from the east. The candle that was burning that represented the east went out.
And then as part of this whole vision, I started seeing a group of people that were communicating with frequency and tones. They're like, not. Not singing. I wish I could describe this. I've tried and tried and tried.
[00:42:20] Speaker E: They weren't really.
[00:42:21] Speaker F: It wasn't music, but it was these tones, and they weren't even really pleasant, but they were beautiful, if that makes any sense at all.
And this is the part when Christina started using the tuning forks, which I had no idea because I, you know, totally was sensory depth. And at some point during these tones, other tones started being added to them that were not made by, like, human bodies or human voices. And I got the sense that, like, this was a communication effort from, you know, like, to cross the veil. And so obviously, these.
If a communication was coming back, it wouldn't be made by, like, flesh and bone. Right. It'd be from some other. Other source. And I just got the real sense that this either was physically how a group of people were communicating at some point in. In this room or in this town, or this is a representation of it. Like, the best explanation someone could give me.
You know, just in my. In my mind alone, it was just. It was the coolest experience.
And I will literally wake up some mornings and just hear this still. And I've gotten up a couple of times to try to write, like, you know, try to write what it is, and I just cannot describe it. So that's kind of like my. My white whale at this point. Like, it just. I'm on this journey to at some point be able to either have somebody else experience it and so we can have a shared language or be able to. To be able to describe it. The closest I got was at Para Fest when a lovely human named in bricks was talking about frequency and stuff that they had experimented with and let. Let me hear the sound. I was like. I was so ready for it to be the one, and it wasn't. It was really cool, but it was like, it wasn't the one.
[00:44:07] Speaker C: I'm trying to think of the word that.
I don't know if it's the right word or not, but it's what keeps popping into my head when you say that.
Ethereal. Ethereal, definitely.
[00:44:18] Speaker F: It definitely had an otherworldly.
Yeah, like, that's a. That's a great word. And also not enough.
[00:44:26] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:44:27] Speaker D: And I don't. I don't think we recorded it on video just because I normally don't let people record me when I do spell work, but I think we might have some audio recording of it. I'm not sure. Yeah. Yeah.
And it was one of those moments where, I mean, it moved Frankie to tears while he was listening.
[00:44:52] Speaker F: It was very moving.
[00:44:53] Speaker D: Something we will be exploring more when we go back in September. We're actually going back with someone who they've done a lot of work with using frequency and sound in investigation. So I'm excited to see what that combination does for us.
And I would like to, because our communication with Katherine Clifton was so incredibly strong, I would also, you know, of course I welcome that, but I would love to tap into the spiritualist community of the area knowing that that's who I felt like was watching us more.
[00:45:30] Speaker B: Than we'll be back after these messages.
[00:45:34] Speaker C: Hey, Conundrum crew, have you ever listened to an episode and thought, wow, I wish I could wear this level of chaos.
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[00:46:06] Speaker C: Honestly, it's the perfect representation of our show. Smart, a little confused and totally adorable.
[00:46:14] Speaker B: Just like me.
[00:46:16] Speaker C: Yeah, sure, Jeremy, let's go with that.
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[00:46:36] Speaker C: Because nothing solves a mystery quite like retail therapy.
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[00:46:47] Speaker C: And back to the show.
[00:46:49] Speaker D: Anyone else? I have. I should also say that I have and I think our, our entire team kind of feels this way. A really strong belief that spirit really isn't trapped per se. Not saying that we haven't come across some situation where spirit has been barred from moving, but most of the time our experiences that our communication with spirit has said to us and shared with us that it can come and go at will and that it moves freely.
I think that sometimes. I know you mentioned the dolls. I think for me sometimes I've experienced dolls who sometimes have been given almost the energy of say like a tulpa, where it's just so many people have believed that this doll is haunted, that it then becomes haunted. But I also have experienced, I as a doll collector myself, dolls who tend to have more of a energy presence themselves that spirit might almost like inhabit for communication at times.
That's just been my perception in reading.
[00:47:56] Speaker C: Yeah, that's the whole thing with this whole spiritual possession.
I watched all these documentaries like the Booth brothers did a documentary where they actually interviewed one of Lorenzi's great nieces who had memories of the time and they Were basically told, just don't talk about it, don't acknowledge her. Because they would walk into a room and she would be in one of her trances and basically they stepped over her and just kept moving on.
But the whole beautiful thing of Mary inhabiting her to help her go through the. Whatever she needed to heal from is just, you know, when I first heard of the case, I was like, oh, creep. You know. But once I started digging into it, I kind of saw the beauty behind it and the confusion that Mary had even being in lrancy's body.
Like the one point where she was sitting with her, I can't remember if it was her mom or dad with Dorothy and Asa or both of one of them, or both of them. And she was talking about the pain of, you know, the bloodletting and the, you know, doing the leeches and stuff to relieve the pain in her head.
And at one point she like went to pull up her sleeve and she's like, do you remember the time I cut myself in the yard? And then she looked down and she goes, oh, this isn't my arm. My arm is in the ground.
And with Asa and Dorothy, you know, going through losing her to. I mean, from what I understand, there's a lot of confusion that from. I've heard that she was at one place and then she was at another place. And I've heard she was at two different places. The one place wasn't even built, so she couldn't have been there, but she went to the route, doing the water treatments and all of that stuff. And then she came home, from what I understand, and then went back because she was still having problems. And that's when she passed. There's so. There's so many, like, different stories in regards to it. It was kind of. That's why I spent so long writing the story for it, because I wanted to do it justice.
[00:50:08] Speaker F: Yeah.
[00:50:09] Speaker C: And then with like, lurancy, supposedly Mary visited her when she was giving birth to her first child to take away the pain one last time.
But then Lorenzi went on to live this beautiful, pain free life after the fact.
And then just recently, this is something that I just thought of and it's totally random, but there was so many children that were born after Nervi and Mary. I know they had a couple losses, but where were all these kids in that house?
Bedrooms for taking in Lorancy and all of these other children that were in the house, where did they put them?
[00:50:54] Speaker D: They. They must have shared beds. I'm sure that they Did. I'm sure that they had many little twin beds in there, or they had large beds and they shared beds. You know, back at that time, they would share beds. Even if you were a family with means.
[00:51:09] Speaker C: Right.
[00:51:10] Speaker D: They. And for a farming family, they. They were out there, they would share beds. You know, they'd have three or four little kids in a bed at once. So.
[00:51:18] Speaker C: Well, and I guess there is that other room that I'm. I'm assuming when we were there, it was locked, the one at the top of the stairs. So maybe I don't know what's in that room. So I guess there is another bedroom.
[00:51:32] Speaker A: Actually, it's a closet.
[00:51:33] Speaker C: Oh, is it?
[00:51:34] Speaker A: It is. Because in that main room in the front, it actually has a door to it. And I got nosy, so I went in, and I was like, oh, it's a closet. Yeah.
[00:51:45] Speaker D: And we have to remember that there probably weren't bathrooms in that house. So the spaces where there are bathrooms were either small rooms or closets. It's been reconfigured a little bit. There's also that back stairwell would have been, you know, a servant's bedroom.
So the family, or one family. At one point in time, though, that back portion of the house does seem to be added, even though it's the same brick.
[00:52:12] Speaker C: Right.
[00:52:12] Speaker D: I do think at some point that was added onto the house. So it might have been after the Roth family lived there.
One thing that we discussed as a team that we found really interesting was this concept in reading. Oftentimes that. And hearing other people speak about the story was that these two families lived extremely far apart and that they had no contact with each other, and that maybe they, in passing, at one point, had maybe crossed paths. But the reality of that is when we really, you know, drove the distance and then the idea that the Roths had lived in the downtown area before they moved out to this house is that, yes, it's a small community, and, yes, it seems like a little bit of a distance, even if we didn't have vehicles at that point.
But I'm pretty certain that they knew their neighbors and that they did know one another. I have a hunch, and it's just my personal belief that in writing the book, that the physician who helped them and who stepped in and ultimately, you know, documented everything, maybe did that to make things seem more believable for people who weren't from the area.
There's always just that possibility there. And maybe they weren't a close family. But I do think that if we have this Understanding that both of them were comfortable with spiritualism and the community seems to be as big of a spiritualist community as it was.
The possibility that they knew each other maybe a little bit better is likely. Now, that wouldn't mean, though, in the sense of time, that Lawrencey would have had any sort of an understanding about Mary's experience, and probably not, because I'm sure it was not really spoken about. You know, it's not as if mental health was something that was acceptable at that point in time either.
[00:54:01] Speaker C: Well, and Mary really went through it with.
With the documentation and the different things, you know, not only the having this, the gift of sight in these trances, you know, being able to read things through being blindfolded. She had.
I'm trying to think she had a lot more happen than what Lurancy did and the, you know, having the pet leeches, because that was her only way of having any kind of relief. I couldn't imagine grabbing leeches and sticking them on you and thinking that this is going to help alleviate the pain that she was experiencing. And I mean, I don't, you know, don't know exactly what she was going through. And I know, like epilepsy and all of these different things were not anything that anybody knew of, you know, during these times. And I also looked into, in our episode, we covered some of the things that they used in the asylums.
And there's like the.
The Utica crib where they would lock people in this crib and just leave them because they thought being still would fix them. Or the trip, the.
What is it called now, the tribunal tribination chair, where they would strap them to a chair and there was a hole in the bottom of the chair for them to go to the bathroom. And they would leave them in these chairs for up to six months at a time.
And the hot, cold baths and all of these things that they did. I mean, Jeremy made a good point. We were talking about it the other day when we were driving to work and he had said he goes, you know, with the lobotomies and other things, he goes, at the time, you know, removing the ribs and inflating the lungs for tuberculosis, they were trying to fix things. Not all doctors were evil. They were trying to find cures and trying to find ways to make things better.
There was the ones that were evil and was. Were doing it when they didn't need to. But I could not imagine living in a time like that where let's stick an ice pick in your eyeball and see if it you know, fixes you. That's crazy.
[00:56:22] Speaker D: Yeah, yeah. And. And hopefully you'll do a trigger warning at the beginning of this, because I feel like this is sensitive for a lot of people. Right, right. But I worked in mental health many, many years back as a very young adult and worked for a community based facility. But then we worked closely with the Winnebago County Mental Health Institute, which was a farm actually, when it had started. It's in Oshkosh, Wisconsin. They have a really cool museum if anyone gets an opportunity to go. Not many hours that they're open, but it is really intriguing to go there. And, and you know, we do think about the fact that you could also institutionalize a family member for misbehaving. Right.
[00:57:08] Speaker C: Or having pms.
[00:57:09] Speaker D: Yeah, yeah. And I. And I also really like to point out that, you know, these young ladies in, in the timeframe where they were extremely symptomatic, were also going through puberty and into young adulthood. And as.
As someone who is really tapped into energy, I'll tell you that oftentimes those are points in a household where a household that's never had activity might start having activity. It's just the energetic shift that's happening in the human. I see it oftentimes when women are going through perimenopause or menopause. So those symptoms of things tend to bring about more poltergeist activity. But puberty can bring about, you know, visions and pretty extreme things. It can also then of course, just impact depression and some of those experiences. But if we think about the leeches, think about people who. To cut themselves, to ground themselves, they might be the most healthy, functioning person that you know, and you could have no idea. I worked with a woman who actually went out and did public speaking talking about her experience as someone who cut for grounding. And that was her way of like, bringing herself back to her body.
So when we think about the leeches that was, you know, in reading the story as published originally, that was one of the first things that really stood out to me was, oh, well, she was. She was using these as an acceptable way.
[00:58:47] Speaker C: Right.
[00:58:48] Speaker D: To ground herself.
[00:58:50] Speaker C: Yep.
[00:58:50] Speaker D: Yeah.
[00:58:51] Speaker C: And then when that wasn't helping, that's when she got into cutting and she almost.
She almost died because she had cut herself so deep. But yet the strength that she had, being so low on blood and having to have three grown men try to subdue her in the state that she was in is just, you know, the body is.
[00:59:16] Speaker D: It speaks to that energetic pull. Right. That ability to manipulate energy Right. And not fully understand what's going on. And. And it made me wonder if that isn't what brought the community to really come together in spiritualism as well. Just from what they had experienced.
[00:59:37] Speaker C: Right. And that was the prime of spiritualism when this was all going on. This is when everything was just starting to kind of really.
I mean, I can't remember what year, like, the Fox sisters and stuff, what year they actually came into play, but. And then you've got. Harry Houdini was out there trying to debunk them all. You know, he wanted to believe. He wanted somebody to prove it to him that it could really be. But he's like, you're fake, you're fake, you're fake. I'm bringing you down.
[01:00:08] Speaker D: Kimberly and Denise and I actually grew up in his chosen hometowns.
[01:00:14] Speaker C: Oh, really?
[01:00:14] Speaker D: Yeah. Yeah.
[01:00:15] Speaker C: Very cool. I was actually kind of upset that Ghost Adventures tried to play on the whole Harry Houdini. On their newest season. They went into the Winchester house, which is something that's very near and dear to me because I've always wanted to go there. I haven't been there. Jeremy has.
[01:00:34] Speaker D: But Jeremy, you gotta. You gotta get on that. Make that dream come true. Yes.
[01:00:38] Speaker C: Yeah.
And we.
So that's like, you know, them exploiting that place.
And then they were trying to summon Harry Houdini while they were there. And, like, if he's not gonna come back for his wife, that he's not coming back for you, Baggins.
[01:00:59] Speaker D: Yeah, you know, I, I.
Ghost Adventures is a controversial subject in the.
[01:01:06] Speaker C: Yeah.
[01:01:09] Speaker D: Well, I would say in the Paranor community. Right. Like, there's this, like, thanks for putting things, you know, helping to put things on the map and make this an acceptable hobby. But also, like, we're not like that. Right.
[01:01:23] Speaker C: Like, not many are.
[01:01:25] Speaker D: Yeah. But they do get this opportunity then to go into these places that many of us will never have the opportunity to investigate in that way. And they put a label on a lot of these places that also then really frightens people. And that's one of the many, many things I struggle with. Also, just their approach is, to me, so rude. I would never in a million years go into someone's home and speak to them the way that. Or behave the way that they do. Now, I might go into someone's home and say bad words like in jest, in fun. When we are done investigating and maybe we are sitting around having a nice time together.
But I always kind of let Spirit know. Our whole team is really good about this. We introduce ourselves, we talk about the fact that times are different than when they were alive. And we might say some naughty words or make some inappropriate jokes that to them are really.
[01:02:22] Speaker F: You might wear pants.
[01:02:24] Speaker C: Correct.
[01:02:26] Speaker D: Yes, yes. Yeah. Hang out with, you know, someone else, even though I'm a married woman. Like, we have a band on our team and, you know, I just let them kind of know that that's just us having fun. It's acceptable for the time. And we don't mean any disrespect, but I would never speak with spirit the way that I see that being done.
[01:02:48] Speaker C: No.
[01:02:49] Speaker D: Is not our, our thing.
[01:02:51] Speaker C: No.
[01:02:51] Speaker A: Actually, this reminds me back to the Roth house is when we first sat down, we had the, the obelisk going.
And when we were introducing ourselves, right when it came to Frankie, it said threat. And so it was all women except Frankie. And so we kind of explained, no, he's, he's safe, he's okay, he's one of the good ones. And then disregard came up on the obelisk right after that.
So, so, yeah, that happens too. But we really try to.
[01:03:30] Speaker F: I think Catherine Clifton was like, I.
[01:03:33] Speaker A: Don'T think so, buddy.
[01:03:35] Speaker G: Yeah, that's exactly what I was going to say. I, I, that, well, two things that. It was that kind of approach that kind of overwhelmed me as my first investigation because I've seen millions of them on YouTube and travel channel and all these things, and I'm, I would. Had no idea what to expect because the traditional airtime time slots are those, you know, you walk in, you start screaming, and then you claim demon and then you bounce, you know, and that was just not the experience that I had at all with the twat. So right off the bat, I was like, what is this beautiful, loving experience? I'm, like, so overwhelmed right now. But I think that, you know, everyone in the house, all the spirits in the house also kind of clocked that. Like, I think that that was why we got such good interactions with everyone, because we had so many interactions from start to finish. But it's almost hard to talk about them because they just kind of came so naturally and everything was so calm and it wasn't like, you know, and then there was a ghost in the doorway. Like, it wasn't like that. It was just very calm and interactive and it almost felt commonplace. But I think that that was why we had such a great interaction, is because we did sort of clear the space and explain, this is how we approach things. This is how things are going to go. We mean no disrespect. This is who we are. This is why we're here. And it kind of made us wonder how many people actually do that. You know, you like to think that everyone does, but how many times do they have people just busting down the door and, you know, start demanding interactions and it's like, well, who are you? This is my house. Why are you here? You know, so, yeah, that was.
That was, I think, just a great way to.
To summarize the entire experience is it was just very mutually respectful.
And I don't. I've not seen a lot of that from, you know, the stuff that gets put out there. It felt like a very unique experience to me.
[01:05:49] Speaker C: There's.
[01:05:49] Speaker F: I feel like that's when, you know, when we were definitely being watched, when we showed up and watched for a while.
And I think that's my view of that, is that not a lot of things get talked about in that, except for the what's he gonna wonder in that space? And so there's all these other people that have touched the house, have been involved, have owned it, whatever, and they're all like, let's see what's going. What's going on? Because I feel like this group is maybe gonna listen to us, you know.
[01:06:17] Speaker G: Yeah, maybe someone's gonna want to talk to one of us. And not just Mary.
[01:06:23] Speaker C: I know there's. We interviewed a woman named Jenny. She's part of the Minnesota taps team.
And we had brought her on because she not only investigated the Palmer House in Socrates, Sock Center, Sock Rapids, they're bite right by each other, but she also used to work there.
So she has a special, you know, feeling and a special love for the Palmer House.
And so we had her on. I did what, investigating or research? Not investigating, but research of what I could find. And then I kind of had her as my. Yep, this is true. No, this isn't. This is what really, you know, happen here. This is what hasn't happened. So it was kind of fun because I'm like, okay, this is the perception that the. That the normal person knows about this home. And this is the personal perception that she knows.
And she said that a lot of times the owner of the Palmer House will contact the TAPS team to come and cleanse it, because the energy there is good. But you have so many people going there and so many different events. And, like, the owner doesn't allow Ouija board. She doesn't allow. Like, if she gets wind that you have a Ouija board, you know, she won't. Will not allow it. And she'll even kick you out. And so she was talking about how a lot of times the Palmer House, like, calls to them, literally, to come and, hey, give us a little spring cleaning, because the energy's starting to get dark or upset because you have people coming in and screaming at you and doing things that don't have experience.
Like, Jeremy and I, we don't have any experience. We just know what we've seen and researched. And so when we did go to the Roth house, we came with very good intentions. We, like you guys, introduced ourselves, just said that we. If anybody has anything to say, we're here to listen, you know, and we weren't, you know, screaming at the top of our lungs demanding things. And, well, the partiers were screaming at the top of their lungs, but not in the region.
My sister was so funny. She was, like, the one that initiated this. Her and her friends were the ones that initiated this stay.
And then we get there, and she was just like, nope, nope, not doing it.
[01:08:50] Speaker D: Not.
[01:08:50] Speaker C: Not doing it. And she's just like, if the ghosts want to party with us, we'll be in here. So come party with us. Come sit down, play cards, play games. We're a good time.
But she didn't want to do anything else, but it was just, you know, so we did have screaming and yelling, just in a different sense.
[01:09:09] Speaker D: I think. You know, one thing, too, that. That oftentimes people forget to do is just to look at what if you're looking at the history of a property, even if you don't want to know the history, you can look up the date when the house is built or have a team member do that, and you can kind of take a guess about and look at what were customary, respectful societal rules for visiting someone's home during that time.
Making sure that you acknowledge the difference as you go in, like, that is just one of those little things that we have found great success with. And the other thing is, is that I always have a ritual of saying hello or goodbye to my home.
And Denise, on one of the first times that we stayed together as the current four of us that we are, I remember her being like, are you going to go in and say goodbye to this house? We had an Airbnb. It wasn't haunted. We just were staying there while we were at another event.
And all of us did. And it has just become regular ritual for us now as a team to give gratitude to the space that we're going into.
[01:10:27] Speaker C: I love that.
[01:10:28] Speaker D: Yeah. Yeah, I love that. Denise always reminds us she's always the last one to do like one more walk through the house. She's so good about it. She's also the person who looks up a lot of our history before we go to a space.
And then, you know, Kim usually is kind of in that mix with her. They share with one another. And then I spend like the drive there being like, stop talking about it. I don't want to know this. Like, don't give me any hints.
And. And because they're excited. But yeah, yeah, it is. So Kim's always our driver. She's so good. Like everybody, you know, I ride passenger princess and stomp on the imaginary brake. But the reality is, is when I drive, everybody's terrified.
[01:11:14] Speaker C: So, yeah, yeah.
[01:11:19] Speaker A: To divert it away from my driving.
I think that's one thing that, that I think was so good about the Roth house is because none of us were prepared for Katherine Clifton and we didn't. There's. There's really not a lot of history publicly about her.
And she just loves that house and that property so much.
And so that was really a joy for all of us because we were exploring it. We were like, oh, this is a really cool thread. Let's follow this.
And I think it's one thing that we've been really shown throughout the investigations that we've done that just because there's a history associated does not limit who you can connect with in that property. And that's, you know, like a lot of these properties are at least one hundred and something years old. Even properties that can be two years old can really can really, I guess I want to say, like, bring you closer or bring other experiences to you. So I know a lot of people probably don't like the idea of they can go anywhere and communicate with whatever. But it's not really limited to a location necessarily. But we do really love the surprise of not knowing so much and then following that thread when things start appearing and coming through.
[01:12:50] Speaker C: Definitely. Did you guys venture into any of the local establishments and meet any of the locals from the area and ask them about the Roff House at all?
[01:12:59] Speaker D: We went out for Mexican food one night. I think that was the extent of our venturing out, really.
Other than that, we did not. That might be something that we consider doing the next time.
[01:13:12] Speaker C: I would highly recommend it because it is so interesting listening to people's perspective. I mean, everybody in that town is terrified of that home and everybody we encountered.
And they all have stories of different people that have been in there. It's never firsthand. It's always, you know, twice Third removed or whatever.
And they all have stories about it. And we actually have one guy. I'll have to send you his little clip. He let me video him. I said that I'd put it on the podcast if I got a chance to. And the other thing that shocked me is I wasn't prepared for how, I mean, I live in a small town in Minnesota. I was not prepared for how, how rural, how like not suburbany. Being in Illinois and I being as close to Indiana, I was not prepared for the dialect, the accents.
I was like, did we step into another world?
It was crazy.
[01:14:18] Speaker G: And some of the way I'm cracking up because I grew up very close to there.
[01:14:25] Speaker D: Did you?
[01:14:25] Speaker G: I grew up very close to there and I live in Wisconsin now.
And my husband always makes fun of me for having a southern accent.
And I'm like, I don't have an accent. I don't have any dialect. I just speak the way I speak. And when I went there, I was like, wait, this is how I sound actually.
Like, this does sound very different to me now after being in Milwaukee for seven, eight years. No way. Okay, I hear you.
[01:14:53] Speaker D: You have an Indiana Midwest accent.
[01:14:56] Speaker G: Yeah, I have a. Yes, I. When I spend too much time with my husband, the, the big and the all comes out. Okay, so I'm a little more northern now. But yeah, I did. I noticed the same thing because I, you know, I've been saying for years that there is no difference in dialect. Like there is no accent. It sounds exactly the same as you.
And then when I went down there, I was like, oh, no, it doesn't at all that, like I clocked that immediately. I pulled into a gas station on my way in and I was like, oh, this is what he's talking about.
[01:15:30] Speaker D: I love even when you say oh, like the difference between you, like you're like, oh. And I'm like, oh, it's totally different.
Right.
[01:15:41] Speaker G: Thank you. I'll tell her.
[01:15:44] Speaker C: When we went on a road trip, we kind of did this big road trip. Went from Minnesota, went to Tennessee to help my in laws move in. Decided to take the long way home. We went through Georgia, Alabama, spent the day at the ocean, the Gulf of Gulf of Mexico. Then we went to Louisiana, New Orleans, did a swamp tour, did like a three, four hour tour of New Orleans and then went from Texas back. So we all did this in a two day time period. Oh, holy anole. We were on our way home. The weather was so bad in Tennessee, all we were doing is staying in the house.
So my daughter Had. My youngest had never been to the ocean, so we brought her down to the Gulf, and that's where it triggered this whole thing. I'm like, well, we've never been to New Orleans, so let's do a quick swamp tour, and let's book the quickest tour that we can get to get the most information about the area and stuff. And everywhere I stopped, it was like every state, the term of dial or the term of endearment changed. The accent changed.
And everybody would ask, I would say something, and they're like, oh, you're from the north, aren't you?
Like Minnesota? And they're like, you know, the way I see Minnesota or whatever. And it's like, I know there's certain things, because I grew up in northern Minnesota that I have that strong tendency to have that, you know, not like the Fargo accent, but some things come out that way, but I don't hear it. And people always, oh, say about. Say this.
[01:17:18] Speaker D: For years, I had a punk rock friend who was someone who would hop trains and hitchhike across country.
And I've had the same cell phone number since I was 15 years old. And so he would call me in the middle of the night, and I'd answer my phone, I'd hear, say it. Say it. And I'd say, how now, brown cow? And then, like, laughter would erupt in the background, and he'd hang up, and I'd be like, okay, fine. Like, so if he's listening, you can still call that phone number and I'll still say it for you, because I haven't talked to you in years, just on that off chance. But, yeah, yeah, I. I always say that Ohio actually has one of the strongest Southern accents.
[01:18:03] Speaker C: Do they?
[01:18:04] Speaker D: That I've heard. It is like, I never would have imagined that. But, yeah, I've never been there, but around getting different dialects.
[01:18:12] Speaker C: Yeah, it is.
[01:18:13] Speaker F: It's funny as a. As. As a writer, like, you can't write a dialect, you know, So I. I observe, like you said, the terms of endearment, things like that. I observe those because when you're writing someone, you throw in, you know, it's like if you call someone doodlebug, they're from New Orleans or whatever, you know, it's like that's how you have to get it across. So I'm super sensitive about the words that everyone is using. And, yeah, it. It changes. Like in. In Chicago, it changes as soon as you're outside of the city. It's another world.
[01:18:41] Speaker C: Oh, yeah, it really is.
And, like, Minnesota, I really don't think. I mean, we'll use Hun. You know, maybe here and there.
[01:18:49] Speaker D: Hun? Yeah, we use Hun.
[01:18:51] Speaker C: Yeah.
[01:18:51] Speaker D: Up here, yes, but not.
[01:18:54] Speaker C: I mean, not that much.
But like, you go to the gas stations and stuff like that. And when, like I said, when we did that tour. Honey, baby, sweetheart. You know, like when we had to call to let the Swamp tour, people know that we were running late because there was an accident. Oh, don't you worry, baby. I got you. I got you. You know, And I was just like, wow.
[01:19:14] Speaker D: I know. It really makes you feel loved and like, right?
[01:19:17] Speaker A: Yeah.
[01:19:18] Speaker D: Yeah, it does. That's why I love. I love New Orleans.
Frankie. Same. We. You know, I mean, it's. I always say I feel so appreciated whenever.
[01:19:29] Speaker C: They're very, very sweet a lot. I mean, anything Southern is enemies. Say they got or blue left. They talk about, you know, like the Midwestern nice or Minnesota nice or whatever. And it's.
I mean, I feel the south has more manners than some people in our area. The other day, I was holding a door open. Two people in a row held a door open. And I'm like, you're welcome.
[01:19:56] Speaker A: Nothing.
[01:19:56] Speaker C: Just walk right on by, and I'm like, if I could shut it in your face, I would, but it's too late. I already opened it for you.
[01:20:04] Speaker D: I've just gotten to the point where I just stand at the door and wait for someone to open for me. Now, at this point, I do. Sometimes I do because I. I think to myself, like, excuse me. Like, wait a minute. Why? Why what? Like, I. I don't know. I expect it. I think it's polite.
[01:20:23] Speaker C: It is polite.
[01:20:24] Speaker G: Yeah.
[01:20:25] Speaker D: Yeah. I'm also the person who, you know, will thank my cashier and.
Oh, yeah, and then they'll be like, oh, you're welcome. I'll be like, oh, you should thank me.
[01:20:39] Speaker C: Thank you for thanking me.
[01:20:40] Speaker D: Yeah, yeah. I mean, my kids used to tease me, because I would be like, now we'd walk away and I'd be like, see? I thanked them. But as we walked away, I'd be like, but if you're ever working retail, that's your job. Just remember that. Because I do think we forget to take a moment and put ourselves into whatever we're doing or the people around us and just enjoy things. And I think it's one of the reasons that a lot of us find ourselves in this hobby is that we want to have that connection, whether it be with one another as we go as a group to do it, or with the spirits that we're hoping to communicate with.
But I often talk about, you know, really wanting to focus on seeing people sitting with them when we're having that opportunity.
Don't think about what you're going to say next and move on to those things a little different. When you're doing a podcast, you kind of have to do all of it at once, right?
But there is this collective space of wanting to have that moment of being seen and seeing someone else and having that deep connection.
And I think there's another group of people that really just want to be able to break into being the first one to be able to prove something scientifically.
And I think there's a space for all of that. I hope there's a space for all of that.
I don't think that one cancels the other one out. I think. I don't think that one is superior to the other one by any means.
But overall, it really does come down to just even those who are trying to scientifically prove things. Right. I say that in quotation marks because we don't really have the knowledge of whether or not that fully works.
But even in that sense of wanting to be the first people to be able to prove something or have really good evidence, you're still hoping that you can be seen.
[01:22:48] Speaker C: Oh, for sure.
[01:22:49] Speaker A: Yeah.
[01:22:50] Speaker D: And so coming together in that, no matter where we go or where we travel to, I think that ties it together really well, that that's the experience that we're. We're trying to capture and have both with people here and with the other side.
And many of us have also experienced loss that has brought us to curiosity as well, or maybe had a terrifying experience when we were younger. Tracie. I used to be so afraid of the dark before I started doing this. It was actually one of the reasons I jumped into doing this because I had had terrifying experiences in the dark.
So I encourage you to push through being a scaredy cat, because I really once was myself and tell you that I always tell people I am not afraid of spirits, and you should not be either.
And I'm afraid of spiders in my hair and other humans because there are shitty people. And not saying that there aren't shitty spirits, because there are. There absolutely are, but they're pretty few and far between. And you are strong enough to just be like, I'm not going to give you any time or energy, Don.
[01:24:04] Speaker C: That's very true. And it's funny. I just had a conversation last night.
We invited this woman who's a medium, and A healer to be on our show.
And she wanted to do a conversation and get to know each other first, which I thought was wonderful, because, you know, a lot of times it's just you don't have that time. You kind of get to know each other while you're doing the show. You don't have that hour long conversation.
But she was just like, I'm sorry, I. I'm trying not to read you, but I just want to say I'm sorry for everything that you've gone through.
And she had brought up that I grew up in a very old haunted house. And I always try to tell myself it was probably what I was just an overactive imagination, you know, whatever.
But there was other witnesses and other people that experienced stuff and whatnot. And she had said, she goes, I am seeing. She goes, it's not just the house, it was the property. And she goes, I am seeing eyes staring at you.
And all of a sudden I was just like, it triggered. I had completely forgot. I would tell my mom every time I went to the barn to feed the horses and the pigs that I felt like I saw eyes and something was staring at me. I had completely put that in the back of my head and blocked that out until she said it. And I'm like, yeah, there was eyes that I always saw. And it was always, no, it's. You've caught a reflection, you caught this, or whatever. And so I told her, I shut myself off to anything paranormal.
I am intrigued by it. I love it, but it terrifies me.
And I've been trying to be more open. Like when we were at the Roth house, I had to literally put my earbuds in and turn my tablet on so I would not hear anything. I was terrified of hearing something. And everybody else was asleep. And I told Jeremy, I said, you are my protector and you're snoring away next to me while I'm terrified. That's not cool.
But I'm trying to get. And I've gotten better with it and more open to experience it. And we also, we own a cleaning business and we have a location that has a lot of activity.
And I have finally gotten to the point where I'm okay going in there by myself.
Whereas before, no way. No way. And I don't care if Jeremy had 104 fever, you're coming with me.
But now I've gotten to the point where I've said it enough times. It's like, I'm just here to make this place better for you guys.
Please just Let me do my work. Let me be.
And I'm trying not to react to things when I see them and they happen.
And like I had told the medium that I had talked to, I said I was literally walking by one of the rooms and this black shadow in a dark room went across the floor. This just happened a few days ago and didn't say anything. I tried to debunk it. I tried walking by the window, tried to see if it was my shadow, if it. If I could figure out what created it. But there was nothing that would have created this black shadow moving across the floor as it did.
And she's like, with you trying to debunk this, she was, you're closing yourself off to it. And I'm like, well, that's what I've done my entire life. I've closed myself off to it and the other things that have happened. It's like, I try to explain it, but there's things I can't explain.
And so I'm trying to be more open and I want to go out and do more experiences and go and do this stuff more often.
And because I would like to be able to.
It interests me so much, but I have to get past my fear.
[01:28:00] Speaker D: I think it's so important to just remind yourself, like, nothing bad has happened to you from these energies you've come across, right? Nothing bad has happened to you. And you ultimately, how much you believe in yourself is the amount of boundary you can set, right? So saying, like, this is unacceptable for me, putting it out there, verbalize it, if you need to think about it, whatever feels like it gives you the most strength, that really helps. And then I will say, you know, I know I'm going to ruffle some feathers, but be cautious of people who have ability, or let me say this, I feel like everyone has abilities or the possibility to.
[01:28:41] Speaker C: Right?
[01:28:42] Speaker D: But be cautious of people who have focused on developing their ability and see that as their identity that tell you that you're in danger or have, you know, they read you without asking.
They.
Yes, we pick up on things, but we can.
We can be respectful, right?
People who tell you that things are negative all the time, or this is evil, or those that feeds into the concept of, like, us versus them separating out something, and it does nothing but bring about destruction and breakdown of communication.
So just always be cautious of that. As you know, I spend a lot of time as someone doing what I do, doing a lot of recovery work for people who've been scared by someone who has, quote, unquote, read Them.
And it's not to say that the reader didn't have ability, but. But it's the reader's own perception of. Of what they're placing on it. And so just, you know, recognize that all I can say to you is, like, everything you've shared with me so far, you haven't been harmed? No. No one has intentionally.
Not. It doesn't seem like you're saying anyone has intentionally startled you if they have. Like, those are the people that you need to.
Your spirits that you need to set a boundary with.
[01:30:11] Speaker C: But, oh, they. They try. I mean, I've had things fall like, I'll be vacuuming. I'll be on the other side of a classroom, and all of a sudden, just. With no reason, something just bloop right to the ground.
[01:30:24] Speaker D: I mean, kids are assholes. I have two children who are now adults, but, like, I also have six younger siblings. And I was a kid once, too. We all went through that sassy, like, little streak. And I say that in the most loving way of being able to say it, but really, like, you know, so you are going to have them push back because they're still learning where their boundaries are. If you're cleaning a school room.
[01:30:47] Speaker C: Yes. Yeah, it's the. It used to be a clinic that they bought and turned into a daycare center.
And I don't think that there's anything like evil or dark.
There is a prankster there. There is a jokester. And I basically, like I said, had to, like, in my head and even out loud sometimes, just let me do my job. I don't like when you do this stuff, like, shirts pulled, hair pulled. One night I was vacuuming, and I swore I heard somebody walk up behind me and say my name.
And I thought it was Jeremy. I stopped, turned the vacuum off, turned around. There was nobody there. And I was like, okay. The vacuum must have been making a noise that made me think I heard something.
And then as I turned back around, I got a. On the back of my neck and I froze.
Walked upstairs, got Jeremy, and I was like, we need to go outside.
And he's like, you okay? I'm like, yep, we just need to go outside. I would not acknowledge it in the building, you know, and we went outside, and he's like, you are white as a ghost. I'm like, that's because a ghost just blew on my neck.
[01:32:08] Speaker D: Yeah, his handsy old men also exist on the other side.
[01:32:14] Speaker A: That. That actually was my experience in the Palmer House, was I got roped once and someone tried to Climb into bed with me once.
[01:32:23] Speaker D: A different Palmer House, though.
[01:32:26] Speaker A: Oh, is it?
[01:32:27] Speaker D: Yeah, yeah. There's. There's a Palmer House in Minnesota. Right. And then there's also an establishment in Illinois that's.
[01:32:37] Speaker C: Oh, really?
[01:32:38] Speaker D: As well, so.
Yep.
[01:32:40] Speaker A: But nobody. We were talking earlier about the one in Minnesota. Oh, yeah, yeah, we went to. Yeah.
[01:32:45] Speaker D: Yes. Yes. We. We both.
[01:32:46] Speaker A: We.
[01:32:47] Speaker D: We had an adjoining room. Kimberly and I did. And we both felt like someone kind of gotten little handsy in bed.
[01:32:54] Speaker A: Yep, they got a little handsy.
[01:32:55] Speaker C: Nobody better be crawling in bed with me.
[01:33:01] Speaker A: And I think, like, the hard time I had with it was, it's like, is this really happening? Like, did that just happen? Like, what is going on? Like, you kind of are. Like, you start thinking about it and you almost forget to say, hey, not cool. I did not say yes.
[01:33:20] Speaker C: So I had a. I have a funny story, and it's not even ghost related with feeling something crawling into bed with me.
I.
One night I was home with my kids alone when they were like one and three, my two older kids.
And I'm laying in bed, trying to go to sleep, and all of a sudden I feel across my feet on top of the bed, and I freaked out. I kicked my feet and then I hear this thump and like, something sliding down the wall.
What in the hell just happened? And I'm mom.
So I have to put on my brave pants and look under the bed to try to figure out what just hit the wall and slid down. It was one of my hamsters that freaking escaped and crawled into bed with me.
You want to talk about having a heart attack?
I couldn't imagine a ghost that I can't see crawling into bed with me.
[01:34:22] Speaker A: It's funny.
[01:34:23] Speaker C: Oh.
But, well, you guys, I don't want to take up too much of your time, and I can't thank you enough for joining us. I am assuming that Jeremy faded. That's why he disappeared.
[01:34:38] Speaker D: That's all right.
[01:34:39] Speaker C: He had a hard night with GoDaddy.
[01:34:43] Speaker A: Yeah, it's fun when you have all that.
[01:34:47] Speaker C: Thoroughly enjoyed everything. You guys are all amazing, and I look forward to following and hearing all of your next adventures and hearing Catherine, your guys's podcast. I've been listening to it. It's been very fun. You guys have a great personality and great chemistry with each other too.
[01:35:12] Speaker D: Oh, go ahead, Katherine.
[01:35:13] Speaker G: No, no, I was just gonna say we all need to get together sometime.
[01:35:16] Speaker D: Yeah.
[01:35:17] Speaker G: Podcast things.
[01:35:19] Speaker C: Yes. And we're all kind of in, you know, probably within a few hours of each other, so maybe we'll have to Meet somewhere and do some kind of fun, like, you know, event or go and, you know, do an investigation or something. You guys can help ease me into.
[01:35:37] Speaker D: I would love that.
[01:35:38] Speaker C: Petrified.
[01:35:39] Speaker D: Absolutely. Absolutely.
And I just want to say, also, when Katherine said that Gina was with us in spirit, Katherine brought.
She brought a really cute framed photo of Gina with her and made sure that she was with us in every room, which I loved. I loved it.
[01:35:58] Speaker C: Like, that is amazing.
[01:36:00] Speaker D: I love it.
[01:36:02] Speaker G: Speaking of trapped spirits, I truly forced her spirit to be there, actually.
[01:36:12] Speaker C: Well, thank you.
[01:36:13] Speaker A: And we did actually call her, too.
[01:36:15] Speaker C: Did you. Do you facetimer?
[01:36:17] Speaker A: I think we fake.
[01:36:17] Speaker F: I didn't.
[01:36:18] Speaker A: Didn't you facetime?
[01:36:20] Speaker G: We. I don't remember if we facetimed or just called, but that was right before the door closed and people started hearing voices and stuff. I think she may have triggered something or something. I don't know.
[01:36:31] Speaker C: Put her on the panel with all the other pictures and stuff.
[01:36:35] Speaker E: We did.
[01:36:36] Speaker D: We actually did.
[01:36:37] Speaker G: Yes.
Yes.
[01:36:41] Speaker C: I loved the pictures. I wish I would. I'm gonna have to look back at the video of the walkthrough because I do not remember seeing that other stuff in that one room. And we did spend time. And actually, John fired up the.
The old school record player and stuff while we were there. Oh, yeah. And so he cranked it up and had it playing. And it was really weird because I kept saying that I kept feeling vibrations, but telling me that it was from the record player, but not everybody was feeling it. And I'm like, no, when this thing is playing, I am vibrating.
And I had somebody else stand where I was standing, and they didn't feel it.
[01:37:21] Speaker D: So when I was under for Estes, I was in the front room, the front living room. And what I felt was almost like as if someone was saying. Stomping around on the floor in front of me. Like, it was that much vibration on the floor, but only while I was under the second.
I would, like, you know, there was no vibration happening. Everybody else was sitting in the space. Everyone was sitting still.
I. It was, like, physically felt like it was shaking my body. So I think it's interesting that you say that, because it just kind of sparked that memory.
[01:37:59] Speaker C: Yeah, it's. It's crazy how everything kind of, you know, different things come together. And I love this. I've. Like I said, I've been obsessed with the Roth house ever since my sister brought it to my attention. I had. I vaguely heard the story on another podcast years ago. And so I went in, you know, both feet just diving into the investigations and all of the different investigations and the different books. And actually, I got to show you, while I was doing my story, I've got this. I did order the. The Possessed book.
[01:38:41] Speaker A: Oh, yeah.
[01:38:42] Speaker C: And as you can see, it's just like. That's good. That's good. That's good. I got to look into. I mean, I just, you know, did a little. I mean, it's all messed up. I got to order a clean copy because it's got highlights, notes. And then I also downloaded the Ew. The Ew Winchester. I think that was his name.
[01:39:04] Speaker E: The.
[01:39:05] Speaker C: The Doctor. I downloaded his book offline and, you know, went through and was reading that and stuff, and, I mean, I went deep, and I'm like, okay, I gotta stop. I gotta just cut the cord and just, you know, do the story, because otherwise I'm never gonna get it out.
So it just. I got obsessed with the place almost in the story.
[01:39:30] Speaker D: A location that calls you back.
[01:39:33] Speaker C: Oh, for sure.
[01:39:34] Speaker D: And it definitely is so nice as a location because you can sleep there and shower there, and it's not disgusting like so many other locations are.
So please, Airbnb owners who have, you know, a. An interesting past or haunted experiences, please, you know, start making it known. Open it up. We love clean, healthy, happy, friendly places. We can go investigate.
[01:40:04] Speaker A: Well, positive histories. Yeah.
[01:40:07] Speaker D: Yeah.
[01:40:07] Speaker C: Yes.
Well, again, you guys will have. We'll have to share our different things. We've got each other's email and stuff. I'll send you what we have, and then you guys send me what you have, and we'll put it all together. And you guys are more than welcome to use anything that you feel that you can. We don't have much, but it's interesting, and I'd love to hear your feedback on the few things that we did catch, so.
[01:40:32] Speaker D: Absolutely.
[01:40:33] Speaker C: All right, well, thank you.
[01:40:34] Speaker A: And I'm interested when we go back.
[01:40:36] Speaker F: Thank you so much.
[01:40:37] Speaker C: Yes.
We'll have to do something like this again.
[01:40:41] Speaker D: We'd love to.
[01:40:42] Speaker E: Sounds good.
[01:40:42] Speaker C: Yes.
[01:40:43] Speaker E: Yes.
[01:40:43] Speaker C: Thanks, everybody. Thank you. Thank you.
[01:40:46] Speaker B: Thank you.
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